Gameplay Help and Discussion - GGG: Is the Orb of Alchemy vendor recipe working as intended? - Forum - Path of Exile (2024)

(For you who don't know: If you sell two Rare items with the same name (e.g. two Sapphire Knuckle rings) to a vendor, they give you an orb of alchemy. 3 items gives a Regal orb.)

I'm really wondering whether this recipe is working out like GGG intended it to, when adding it.

The common practice is to stuff as many of your stash tabs full with Rare items of all sorts. Usually the ones that take only up to 3 or 4 spaces, though I'm sure some people just throw everything they own inside. Then, simple run the Chrome app and make it find combinations for you, which you can then sell for pretty much free orbs.

I somehow doubt that this was intended, for two reasons:

1. More stash tabs = more slots for rares = more Alchs/Regals. In a sense, this can be seen as buying power. It certainly makes buying additional stash tabs much more attractive.

2. No other recipe works this way. The other orb recipes have clear components and an easy to reach requirement: Whetstones only require items with quality, and only 40% in total. Chaos orbs require any random Rare, and once you have a full set, you can sell em. There's no point in any of these recipes to stock up on as many items as possible to get as many recipes. Just complete the set and get your orb, barely any stash space required.

An added downside is that stashing so many rares takes quite a bit of administration, especially if you're not using the Chrome app yet. Some people said to me that this added inconvenience makes up for the recipe's benefits: if you can stomach the effort of hogging so many rares, you deserve a few extra Alchs.

While I can definitely see that argument, I'm just not really convinced it's good game design. But I'm not one to judge PoE's directions, hence, I pose the question to GGG!

This is a system that people tell us they really enjoy. They like stashing the items and reaping the rewards when they randomly match.

I was initially worried that it'd feel like a "pay to win" system (because obviously paying for more stash tabs allows you to match more items), but we've seen users match items across multiple accounts with great success. Accounts are free (once we enter Open Beta at least!) and have four tabs by default, which is a lot of storage.

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Chris wrote:

This is a system that people tell us they really enjoy. They like stashing the items and reaping the rewards when they randomly match.

I was initially worried that it'd feel like a "pay to win" system (because obviously paying for more stash tabs allows you to match more items), but we've seen users match items across multiple accounts with great success. Accounts are free (once we enter Open Beta at least!) and have four tabs by default, which is a lot of storage.

Eh, tbh, I expected it to be removed eventually.

It after all, almost forces you to use an out of game application to use the recipe efficiently and without it being a big time consumer.

Of course people like getting (almost free) additional alchemy and regal orbs, but is this way of acquring them really fun?

In the end, isn't it just a complicated and, thanks to the app, almost automated way to get additional orbs? Wouldn't it be better if you addjusted either the droprate of those orbs or made a different recipe that doesn't need an outside app to work well?

For example, 3 rare swords (doesn't matter the type) give you an alch and 5 a regal or something the like? One could match them then without the need of out of game software.

In the end, one just dumps all rares in the stash and lets the program run once a day and then sells any matches. Is this really such an interesting game mechanic? I may be very off here but to me it feels a quite wierd thing to have.

I mean, do the people enjoy the process of doing it, stashing the rares and then matching them through the program, or do people enjoy getting better orbs then just by selling those rares to a vendor?

I highly doubt when the idea was implemented GGG had foreseen a community member taking the time to construct and manage an outside application for wide distribution to automate this process.

The X factor in all of it is exactly that, an application was formed.

The suggestion of changing the recipe to something as simple as three rare swords, for example, would increase the rate at which alc's are pushed into the economy far greater than the use of the Chrome extension as there is no need to be specific. In other words, rare swords drop more often than specific rare swords.

The issue isnt that the means of completing the recipe is too easy. The concern should be that rare items are indeed NOT rare. If anything, they are the most common items equipped. And we are still in beta. These items will become even more abundant once the player base grows and throws more farmers into the mix.

The counter to this is that there will also be an increase in those consuming the alc orbs. But I doubt it will be enough to counter act the increase of item flow. I doubt this because there is no mystery to an alc. You know what you are getting every time. You may not get the mods you are seeking, but you know you will get a rare item that will, more often than not, outweigh that of a 2 or 3 stat magic item.

The only sense of rarity to rare items these days, is the rare chance that you will get the stats you specifically seek. The items themselves are far from rare.

If there is a growing concern about the availability of alc orbs, the issue should be addressed by adjusting the recipe to be harder, not easier. The drop rate is already as I am sure it is intended. Across 4 chars and 174 levels in total, I have gotten a total of 13 alc's to drop. Now, that is rare.

If any changes are made at all, it should be to either increase the number of items needed, or remove the recipe entirely and restore the intent behind the title of 'rare'.

The ultimate solution, of course, would be to severely cut the drop rare of the rare items in itself.

I'm beginning to think that being able to pay for more stash tabs is sounding like a pay2win gimmick for the simple fact that you (and not anyone else who doesn't have this feature) can store MORE rare items than that person and be able to come up with MORE combos for orb vendoring.

Even if I'm painting it in this light, you can see how it's akin to a pay2win mechanic. Characters made in the same league all access the same stash, which then having more stash tabs becomes all too important.

Also, I believe it's the +IIR (Increase Item Rarity) on armor-related equipment that yields shards of alch and perhaps IIQ. Not sure what the exact mod it is on weapons. Someone confirm.

And rares with 6+ mods shouldn't be vendored for a measly orb of Augmentation... that's a seriously weak reward for something of that nature. (happens when I can't find ppl to sell my stuff to)

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Islidox wrote:

I'm beginning to think that being able to pay for more stash tabs is sounding like a pay2win gimmick for the simple fact that you (and not anyone else who doesn't have this feature) can store MORE rare items than that person and be able to come up with MORE combos for orb vendoring.

Even if I'm painting it in this light, you can see how it's akin to a pay2win mechanic. Characters made in the same league all access the same stash, which then having more stash tabs becomes all too important.

Also, I believe it's the +IIR (Increase item Quantity) on armor-related equipment that yields shards of alch. Not sure what the exact mod it is on weapons. Someone confirm.

And rares with 6+ mods shouldn't be vendored for a measly orb of Augmentation... that's a seriously weak reward for something of that nature. (happens when I can't find ppl to sell my stuff to)

Raiding, Plunder, and Surgeon (in the event of a flask), there may be more that I am not recalling.

And I know the feeling about vendoring a six stat 'rare', I do it when those six stats are junk or an awkward level that I know nobody will purchase, or if the item is larger than 3x2.

However, I do not agree about extra stash tabs being a pay to win mechanic. I love my extra storage if for no other reason than holding onto extra items in case I do not like the route my current build starts to head.

Truth be told, I vendor 'rare' items more often than I stash them. Granted, this is not the case with everyone. But personally, I only check for alc recipe items when I need an alc. Otherwise, all items in my stash of for my class/build, or for future build ideas.

Yes, there are potential P2W type side effects of the feature, but everything has a down side.

The question is if the positive intent outweighs the negative result. I believe it does, but that is a matter of opinion, obviously.

Just a simple fact to throw out there: you have to pay real $ for extra stash tabs, which provide more benefits over the average player who doesn't have extra stash tabs.

That's how I see it from an objective point of view. (sorry, I didn't want to turn this into another discussion about P2W mechanics)

But I digress. And yes, I know that feeling when I find a 6mod+ rare item... and that feeling of disappointment when I know the stats aren't great and all I'm going to get in return is an orb of aug that doesn't have any value other than to make an orb of alt. (You don't need more than 1 stack of 30 orbs of aug to add a random stat to a magic item. And I get these orbs EVERYWHERE.)

But thanks for mentioning the "Raiding, Plunder, and Surgeon" Prefixes. I'll keep that in mind when I vendor off rare items.

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Islidox wrote:

Just a simple fact to throw out there: you have to pay real $ for extra stash tabs, which provide more benefits over the average player who doesn't have extra stash tabs.

Mule accounts are free.